Lonely Wrist: All Things Watches & Horology
Lonely Wrist dives deep into the intricate world of watches, unearthing the stories, craft, and passion behind every ticking piece. From timeless classics to modern marvels, this podcast winds through the history, mechanics, and cultural significance of timepieces. Whether you're an avid horologist or just someone who admires the beauty of a well-crafted watch, Lonely Wrist offers a unique perspective, uniting enthusiasts and curious minds. Join us every episode as we explore the art of watchmaking, discuss the latest trends, and interview watch industry experts, all while appreciating the silent yet profound voice of every watch's lonely wrist.
Lonely Wrist: All Things Watches & Horology
Behind Serica's Design Philosophy with Co-founder Jérôme Burgert
Ever wondered how a boutique watch brand rises to prominence in a saturated market? Join us as we sit down with Jérôme Burgert from Serica, who shares the captivating journey of creating a watch brand that fuses vintage inspiration with modern precision. Discover the genesis of Serica, co-founded with Gabriel, and their fascination with tool watches from the 40s to the 70s. Jerome offers his intriguing take on encountering counterfeit Serica watches on platforms like Alibaba, considering them as an unintentional nod to Serica's design influence and impact.
We explore Serica's unique design philosophy, which emphasizes simplicity, elegance, and practicality. Jerome details how Serica differentiates itself from brands like Rolex by innovating with distinctive hand shapes and thoughtful design choices. Get an insider's look at their current lineup, including the 6190 field chronometer, the 5303 diving chronometer, and the 8315 travel chronometer, each crafted with a keen eye for originality and functionality. Jerome also shares the challenges and triumphs of sourcing reliable movements, culminating in a successful partnership with Soprod, enhancing both the performance and aesthetics of Serica watches.
Dive into Serica's future aspirations as Jerome discusses plans for expanding their collection to include dress watches, chronographs, and women's watches, all while maintaining a focus on sustainability and timeless design. Reflecting on the emotional connection watch enthusiasts have with their timepieces, we ponder the sentimental value of a "daily beater" versus a "Grail watch." Jerome also shares insights into Serica's global vision and the importance of storytelling in creating a deeper appreciation for their timepieces. Whether you're a watch aficionado or just discovering the allure of finely crafted timepieces, this episode offers a compelling look into the artistry and passion behind Serica watches.
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Hello everyone, Welcome to another episode of Lonely Wrist Today. Every time I say this, we have a very special guest. I always kick off with this, but I truly mean it every single time, and we have arguably one of my favorite watch brands out there crushing it Jerome from Serica Welcome.
Jérôme Burgert:Hi Blake, thanks for having me, oh sorry, phone that's okay, you're a busy guy. Thanks for coming on no, thanks for having me. Really, uh, I appreciate any questions. You might have any. Anything I could tell you about serica watches, I'll be. I'll be happy to share it with you and your audience.
Blake Rea:We've got tons of stuff. Let let's kick it off proper. Let's start with the origin story of Serica. What inspired you to start a watch brand? You and Gabriel.
Jérôme Burgert:It's rather simple really. I mean every possible, every brand has its own story For us, without going back to our respective backgrounds, because what we did before obviously led us to creating Serica today, because without meeting the proper people, without trying the proper watches on the wrist, you cannot create what we are creating right now. You know it's thousands of watches on the wrist, historical designs, studies, vintage pieces that fed us and fed me my eye, because I do design the pieces. But if it had to be summed up into a very simple way, I'd say the true will to really give birth to, you know, to what I consider to be the real tool watches. In a nutshell, you love watches, I do love watches and I'm sure we will agree, not only you and I but many other people around, that the golden age of watchmaking is not 2024.
Jérôme Burgert:It was basically between the early 40s to the late 60s, mid-70s to be fair, and during that era some people worked really well.
Jérôme Burgert:They gave birth to what we still consider today to be among the most amazing PCs in watchmaking.
Jérôme Burgert:And if we talk about tool watches, to me these tool watches and we're talking late 60s, obviously, or early 50s to late 60s had something that has disappeared for a long time and that is very, very hard to come across a modern piece.
Jérôme Burgert:But I'm not talking just today, I'm talking about for the past 20 years, and that magic thing is blending the true characteristics of an instrument, meaning precision, meaning reliability, meaning water resistance, all of this but combining it with a beautiful object of design, because beauty means everything and it makes our daily lives much better, much better. So if it's not beautiful or relevant, or if it doesn't have a personality, obviously you will be, I will be, you will be less eager to to crack a smile in the morning and put it on your wrist. So it was truly about having a new dive watch, field watch, gmt watch that does not try to look like or embody anything else but serica watch and that blends the highest standards of performance with the beautiful finishing, with the most beautiful finishings, materials and and design. And we're struggling to combine all these together and give birth to very unique pieces.
Blake Rea:That's that was a core motivation and still is I wouldn't say you guys are struggling to do that because, um, I was talking to some of my friends say you guys are struggling to do that because I was talking to some of my friends about you guys coming on the podcast and yeah. So essentially they brought it to my attention that there is on Alibaba or DHgate or some of these. Chinese websites copies clones of Serica watches out there.
Jérôme Burgert:I know what, what can you do? You know the very first day, the very first morning, when you hear and see about those, because you receive tons of messages, hey, hey, do you know about that? You know about that. It's um, it's not fun, it's not pleasant. Uh, because basically the hard work and the heart we put into serica watches every day is not open source, it's not open bar for those people to steal our work and make a quick bug out of it. You know.
Jérôme Burgert:But in another way and friends of mine helped me realize that option one, I mean we can't do anything about it. Those guys hide in China, in Australia, wherever, and if I wanted to fight them it would mean a lot of energy, a lot of time, a lot of money, and I'd rather spend these on building something than fighting something else. But it's also proof that we're creating something that stands for itself. When you do create a design and you have a very minimalistic branding approach, like we do, I mean you can't see serica written big on the dial and people are copying these and branding them as homage. 5303 serica watches.
Blake Rea:There was like, okay, I mean rolex has homages, like, if it's not relevant design, people won't try to steal it anyway, so you know I try to, I try to relax with that kind of mindset yeah, that's like the certification that you are going down the design history books right there hopefully fingers crossed tell us the 5303 is one of my favorites. I currently now, thanks to Gabriel, I have the entire Serica collection. You have one of each in your possession right now.
Blake Rea:Yes, yes, for now, and I'm looking forward to doing some content about them. Obviously, by the time this podcast releases, it will probably already be out, but I have enjoyed my time with the 5303. The Field Watch is amazing, the 5303, the GMT is such a I don't know how to describe it. I get this experience that not a lot of people are going to get. I don't know if all of your customers have all three watches Probably not, right, quite a few, but not all of them All right. Yeah, there you go, but somehow the designs I'm trying to think of the best way I can describe this. I'm at a loss for words. Sure, sure, sure, take your time. But they're so integrated but they're so different at the same time, like it feels like a torch is being passed from piece to piece.
Jérôme Burgert:It's exactly that. Because it's you know, when you build a brand from scratch, it's not playing watches and try to, it's the opposite of homage watches. Because you try to express yourself with the language that you did not. Well, I did not invent the vocabulary, because the vocabulary to me is what has been passed on to me, passed down from previous generation of watch designers. I did not invent the black dial or the rotating bezel, did not invent the GMT complication, or I did not invent any of this, but I'm trying to. I'm trying to, yeah, to use those words and create my own language, my own poetry.
Jérôme Burgert:It's, you know, the watch design is something that is extremely fragile. We're working on a very small scale and every tiniest hundreds of a millimeter that you change will affect the entire feel, look and feel of the watch. So once you understand that, even if you use a vocabulary that dates from the 50s or the 60s, I mean, you can write something entirely different. It's, for example, what I did with the GMT coming up with a lollipop GMT hand. It's never been done before. These two-time 12 hours with the anti-meridian, post-meridian indexes never been done before. It's those tiny little things that it's just like asking yourself. I read that not long ago about originality. Originality is not trying to be different. Originality is actually going back to the origin and that's what it is about. You go back to the origin of the the question that's been asked and you answer this question with your own design, language and approach.
Jérôme Burgert:Uh, building a GMT watch is not popping a Pepsi bezel on the diver's case. It's not playing with an orange hand or a red arrow hand. It's no. You go back to the origin. What's the origin of a GMT watch? It's displaying a second time zone with a day-night indicator, and you can do that any way you want. You have a plethora of hand shapes for hours, for minutes and, surprisingly, for GMT hands, people stuck most brands stuck with a Rolex approach. But that's precisely what it is the Rolex approach. It's not for what it is the Rolex approach. It's not for Serica to use, it's not for me to use, it's for me to create my own.
Jérôme Burgert:So it's a very simple answer to that question. I did not. You read 12 hours on the dial oops, sorry here and 24 hours on the bezel. So if you want something that's easy to read, you need those hands to be different, because you don't read it with the same scale. It doesn't have to be red, it doesn't have to be orange, it doesn't even have to be a different color, it just has to be distinctive, slightly different. So I just changed the infill, which is not even super luminova, because the 24-hour bezel does not glow. So having a hand that points to nothing in the dark doesn't make sense. And it's just by by asking myself those questions that I found the most simplistic possible answers, and it gave birth to a watch that looks, hopefully, nothing like a 1675. Hopefully.
Blake Rea:I would say it's very distinctively Serica.
Jérôme Burgert:I hope so.
Blake Rea:Speaking on the design language, I mean as a designer, I'm sure you're grounded by concepts and strategies.
Jérôme Burgert:What kind I don't get the question, sorry. What kind of strategy?
Blake Rea:if you could just if you could describe serica's design philosophy. Yeah, if you could bring that to words, is it possible, uh?
Jérôme Burgert:I tried not long ago working on on describing the brand and what we're trying to achieve in the fewer possible words you, because not everybody has a podcast of an hour, podcast to hear what I have to say, sure, and so, basically, what we're trying to create and that's why every single watch we're creating did evolve for the past five years. So, as you know, everything now is automatic. Obviously it's Swiss, it's chron, obviously it's Swiss, it's chronometer, certified, it's waterproof. That's for the specs, basically. And now for the design language.
Jérôme Burgert:What we came up with is, if I have to tell you what a Serica watch is in one sentence, it's a singular and sophisticated, waterproof, swiss chronometer. That's what it is and that's what we built basically. So, in terms of design language, I would say singular as different and sophisticated, because we don't want something, we want to answer the question with design, but we want to answer the question in an elegant way. You know what I mean. But we want to answer the question in an elegant way. You know what I mean. Designers often say that the most simplistic answer is always the best, and I tend to agree. But at some point, when you have an answer that is simple, then you still need to give it birth. You still need to give that idea and that answer a tangible form, and there are many different ways to do that and we try to make sure that the Serica ways have always that little extra knack of ooh.
Blake Rea:I did not think about that before, but it's a classy touch let's talk about. First of all, we can go through the lineup right. You have a very simple collection. Congratulations on the new 6190s, thanks.
Jérôme Burgert:Do you have one of those in your possession? I do not. I have the, well, actually I have the California I would have very surprised, because we have very few of those. Even I don't have any.
Blake Rea:That says a lot. Yeah, yeah, that says a lot. Um, yeah, yeah, I saw at wind up uh, gabriel had showed me the polar uh of the 6190 I think he had. I think he had the polar or the storm gray or something with him in his possession, one of each, I think yeah and uh, he was like yeah, this, you know, this is the new 6190, this is where we're headed, you know, and I was like man, you know, and we featured the 6190, california, in our best of show article.
Jérôme Burgert:Thank, you very much.
Blake Rea:Which, yeah, was impressive because that was the first time I'd ever seen your brand. And, yeah, you have a very simple collection. You got the 6190, the field chronometer. You got the 5303, the diving chronometer, the the 6190, the field chronometer. You got the 5303, the diving chronometer, the 8315, the travel chronometer. Um, I don't want to push you, but I'm sure you're going to expand the lineup soon.
Jérôme Burgert:Um, it's um, yeah, the thing there is there. There are many reasons to that. You know it's a. I always build everything one step at a time. I mean rushing, especially in whatever you do, but especially in watchmaking, especially in design, it takes time, it needs time to grow up. You know, when you bring, especially in watchmaking, when you bring new designs to the table and we experience that because what we do is different so it needs time to be, I don't know to be understood, to be accepted to be.
Jérôme Burgert:If I, if we go about designing many different things, if we go into 10 different directions, if we go into 10 different directions at our very early age, then how could I have the pretension of asking anyone to know and understand what a serica watch is? So it's. I mean, it's obviously for us to send a message out there. This is our proposition, this is a serica watch, this is what we do. But then you know, and I, that a message gets lost in translation in the process and, like you can send 100 and maybe 10% will get to you. So I need to make sure that I don't send too much, because I want this message to be extremely relevant and clear and, as a designer, my approach to design is extremely purpose-driven, as you might have understood, and if tomorrow you ask me, or today, because today's the day if you ask me any question about the relevance and the reason of any hundreds of a millimeter of one of my watches, if I do not have an obvious, clear answer, then that would turn me into a very sad person. So I try to think about our lineup as something that will last in time.
Jérôme Burgert:It's like watches, I mean, they evolved but they did not change. For anyone who bought a Serica field watch five years ago, they still own very much a Serica field watch. Of course, now we have a few dire variations. The case has evolved slightly. It's now automatic, quarter meter certified. It's thinner. It's the material evolved. It changed, but it's not a different watch. I can no, I don't have any here but if you put them side by side it's still very much a Serica watch and that's what I'm trying to create. You know, a design language that will last in time and is easy to understand, and it's taking off slowly.
Blake Rea:I mean, it feels like your watches are literally like pulled from a time machine. You know, and dropped in modern. You know modern day, you know. So in theory, you're inspired by timeless design and you're creating timeless watches. So in theory, you know your watches have already been out there for 50 plus years.
Jérôme Burgert:You know your designs, yeah of course, of course, plus years. You know your designs. Yeah, of course, of course, but uh, and it's uh. I mean, obviously it would be extremely cocky and pretentious. Yeah, I'll be something tiny, that's not what I'm saying at all. But if you do not design with the ambition of creating something truly special and truly timeless, it does not happen by mistake, it's a magical thing, but it just doesn't happen by itself. You need to be self-aware.
Jérôme Burgert:I think, as a designer, that every choice you make will have an impact on the life of your watch, and you know, I've been. We created the company five years ago with Gabriel, but designing watches and owning my own watch company and offering what I do believe is a great watch has been on my mind for the longest time. And I started designing, drawing watches when I was what? 12, 13, 14 years old. So fast forward 20 years later, when I finally had the guts and the right associates to do so, I I did take it very seriously, and I still do. You know, creating something to me is truly a responsibility. I'm it's funny my, my brother just just, uh, just just bought me a book recently and uh, it's a small book, but I do design.
Jérôme Burgert:Why beauty is key to everything. By alan moore, I think, and by reading the book I was yeah, obviously, I mean that's the that the drum conversation I have with my friends. You know it's a, but it is. I mean, beauty is key to everything and as a designer, your responsibility is to bring to life an object of beauty. Of course we're talking micromechanics, we're talking purpose-driven instruments, but it still needs to be a thing of beauty and when you put that into people's lives, starting with mine, it makes the world a little bit of a better place.
Jérôme Burgert:I don't want to flow into something too philosophical out there, but that's the very reason why it's not just a tool watch. It's much more than that. Of course I'm still a 15-year-old kid, deep down wanting to be James Bond. Of course, when I put my watch on a wrist in the morning, I feel a bit more like it. People will find it funny, probably, and then I hop on the metro and I go to work, but it doesn't matter, you know, because that's the idea. A mechanical watch is not something that will save our lives. It's something very it's not. I don't want to say it's outdated, but it's not the instrument it used to be, obviously. So why do we wear watches?
Blake Rea:Because it brings us joy.
Jérôme Burgert:Yeah, Makes us happy, maybe reminds us of a time where internet was not so much present.
Blake Rea:Simpler, you know. Probably and it's an expression of individuality at this point, you know.
Jérôme Burgert:It is, it is, it is at this point.
Blake Rea:You know it is, it is, it is, and, um, and yeah, you know something that I've noticed too. I mean it's just the small, the small details that you can clearly tell, like when I've been wearing the diver, um, I mean just the way that the bracelets design, I mean it's super comfortable. But then you have the high polish chamfer on the lugs and then it, it goes straight down to like a brushed gradial pattern, like right to where the bracelet meets, and I was like you know, that's just, it's just, it's just clean, it's just unique, it's, it's refreshing. You know, I mean you, everybody who's listening, you have to get hands on one of these things to see what I'm talking about. But, um, you know you, you can tell, like, just the everything was thought out and um that a rather obsessive mind did the work.
Jérôme Burgert:Yeah, exactly yeah and that's okay.
Blake Rea:I mean, we're all obsessed, I'm obsessed to shape, to shape yeah, I'm, I'm the sickest person you'll ever meet. I have over 150 watches in my personal collection I'm curious about. So. Gabriel and I had talked briefly about the transition to Soap Rod. Yeah Right, we didn't talk too much about the reason behind it, but it was my understanding that you guys started off and I mean now you're all in on the SoProd train.
Jérôme Burgert:Yeah, so the reason is rather simple really. So when we started the company five years ago, it was a first original batch of 500 watches. And you're no one 500 watches you cannot even knock the door of ETA or SoProd. If I go, who are you? I don't know you. Okay, you will have your movements in a year or two. And obviously we were rather inexperienced with the manufacturing of mechanical watches. So we purchased actually from friends who had another brand, we purchased a batch of 500 ETA 2801 movements and we started working with that. But then, at the very end of the very same year, eta, which is part of Swatch Group, announced sorry guys, not selling to anybody outside the Swatch Group.
Jérôme Burgert:So it didn't really help, right, yeah, so then we worked briefly with STP as well, which is part of the Fossil Group in Switzerland, and it did work. Don't get me wrong, but partnering with someone it's obviously about what they can offer and the quality of their product, but it's also about relationship, about how you get along with the human people behind it and how easy and nice it is to work with them. And we did meet the Soprod team and their owner, mr Rodriguez, which is a very nice guy who appreciates very much what we do. And having Soprod Calibre housed in Serica watches and working with them it's been a breeze and it truly felt like partners, not just a provider, meaning when something goes wrong, they're here to help and we work together, and that I like very much. And the caliber we used in the entire collection right now is the M100. So it's a caliber that's been around for a long time. It was previously named the A10, a10 II, then evolved, like many evolution, until the M100.
Jérôme Burgert:But the bottom line is this movement is great for many reasons in my opinion. It's chronometer, certified, it's automatic, it's been around for, yeah, 20 plus years, so it's reliable. And, most importantly, years so it's reliable. And, most importantly, you know when you design sports watches, you want something that's tough, that's reliable. You want a workhorse of a movement, especially for us. I mean, we go with the elaborate finishing, then code de genève and everything, but we have solid case back. So it doesn't, you can't, you can't see the movement anyway. So this is not a Westminster carry-on, it's just a workhorse of a mechanical movement. And the M100 is thinner than most Meaning. If you take any 11.5 line movements, that's the diameter, wide on the caliber, that's what is used usually for sports watches, and if you go to ETA or if you go to Sellota, these movements will be 4.6 millimeter thick. If you take the M100, it's 3.6 millimeter thick only and one full millimeter in watchmaking. It's a mountain actually when you do design everything around the movement. So it allowed us to work on three different directions for the three collections that you have in hand.
Jérôme Burgert:Obviously, I discovered the M100 when we did the GMT, because the M100 is the base caliber for the C125. So it's basically M100 with the GMT module on top of it. So it's basically M100 with the GMT module on top of it and even with the module, it still enabled me to design a 12.3 millimeter thick GMT watch, which I enjoyed very much because it made for a very, very pure and very sleek case profile. Then I was wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. What happens if I put this in a diver? So it was not an easy thing, because you know you want to keep the same case, well, the same thickness. You don't want to make it any thicker. You need the crown to remain perfectly centered. And I was like but can I work on an anti-magnetic cover? And it still took us time and people don't realize, oh, this new movement, and there is, but it's, it's a lot of work. I mean, I, I did those technical drawings maybe 10 times, sending them to the guys. I'm not an engineer, I'm the, I'm the poet with the pen.
Blake Rea:That's who.
Jérôme Burgert:I am. So it still goes back to guys who tells me this we can do, this we cannot do, and nine times, do this we cannot do, and nine times they told me we cannot do. And the tensile, what about if we do that and that and that? I can be rather persistent and I was like, okay, this works. And so we could manage, by keeping the 12.2 millimeter thick case to add the magnetic cover. But it's not just the cover, right, it's the cover, it's the inner case ring and the dial itself that are now manufactured in what we call people call it soft iron, but it's or mu metal, it's basically iron and nickel.
Blake Rea:Yeah, it's like a blend.
Jérôme Burgert:Yeah, exactly, and for the new 6190, we transitioned as well. It was like whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. What can we do? Because, obviously, when you already offer automatic Swiss chronometers for your dive watch and GMT, I mean having a mechanical hand-wound field watch in the mix. It's still beautiful, but it doesn't make much sense. We said it earlier. I like the message to be clean and relevant. So it's like okay, now it's time for the field watch to get the COSC treatment in a way, and this movement being thinner, we could actually add the rotor upgrade to the new M100 caliber and still manage to chop down almost an entire millimeter and a half of the case profile, including the crystal. So we dropped down from 11.8 down to 10.4 millimeter thick and I mean you have it on the other side of the screen.
Jérôme Burgert:So, you can tell people, you put it on the wrist and it's I mean, it's a 200 meters water resistant watch. It's a beautiful watch and it's super thin. So it's again. It embodies everything I love about watches the robustness and the elegance.
Blake Rea:Yeah, something that I've noticed and you know, obviously, before Wind Up San Fran this past year, you know I hadn't had much experience or getting hands-on with your products. You know, obviously there's a lot of great watch brands that are direct to consumer. You know, you guys. You know, because of your price point, I'm assuming you have no choice but to stick in that model.
Jérôme Burgert:Um for now or invent new models.
Blake Rea:Yeah, yeah, I we'll talk later about that. Um, but something that was super surprising is is just how like compact I would say the package is. Um, I've noticed it very much so with the field chronometer, um, how it wears, how compact it is. Um, you know, I I have a relatively I would consider small wrist, you know, below seven inches um, but it's it still feels like it has a big personality, it does, and that's something that's so, is so it's so different to me. Um, and you know, obviously, the way that I worked is I got the, the field chronometer, and I got the gmt, the travel chronometer, and then, after I, I said to gabriel, I was like dude, like I'm missing one watch here, like, just send me another one Because I want to show the entire brand, the entire portfolio. It's much more challenging to do with other brands than it is for a brand like yours, where I get three watches out of the entire portfolio. Correct, but ever since the 5303 came in, this, one won your heart.
Blake Rea:Yeah, I just haven't took the other ones out.
Jérôme Burgert:Okay, sorry, I'll be sorry.
Blake Rea:And I thought it would be different. Like I was like, all right, you know, aesthetically, the 6190, the field chronometer was like the right, you know, aesthetically the 6190, the field chronometer was like the one that spoke to me like okay, like I see it online, like this is the perfect watch for me. Um, but then you know, the 5303, just I mean just swooped in like overnight and put, put the chronometer, the field chronometer, to sleep for me for some reason, um, but I have different personalities for sure.
Blake Rea:Yeah, yeah, and I mean I like the practicality, like the hours and minutes on the bezel, like something that like I had never.
Jérôme Burgert:I have never seen that before um, it's been done before but to knowledge, not on two different materials. You know what I mean.
Blake Rea:Yeah, yeah. And just I mean the way the bracelet integrates into the case. I mean it's still compact but it still feels like it has wrist presence.
Jérôme Burgert:It does. It's surprisingly enough. I mean, all these watches, they have different sizes, different dial openings, different strap integration, but when you put them on a wrist, I think they all have a very similar presence, despite the fact that the field chronometer is just 37.7 millimeter wide and 10.4 millimeter thick. The other one is 39 versus 12.2. But the fact that the, the ratio and the, the game of proportions that stay within each watch makes each time an ensemble that's very easy to wear on the wrist and with a similar presence, again, it's it's a very, very fragile thing yeah, it's.
Blake Rea:It's something that was very apparent for me is, and so I I don't think we talked to, I mean, my background. Right, I sold 30 of the most luxurious brands, okay in the world, right, and me and just justin my partner, um, who's not here, unfortunately. Okay, we kind of came from we collecting together, but we came from different sides of the industry. Okay, like, when we got into collecting, like I was always had my sights set on, like you know, the big boys, the Pateks and all that and JLC and Vacheron and all that.
Blake Rea:But he actually went into the micro brand space, okay, and like he was like I mean he loves micro brands, so we kind of meet in the middle, um. But but something that I mean is so surprising to me is is the functionality? I mean, it's simple but it's functional. And you could tell that I don't think this is understood by a lot of designers. They're just like okay, this looks good on paper right?
Jérôme Burgert:No, this has to feel good on wrist.
Blake Rea:Yeah, I mean they maybe incorporate a little bit of that. But something that was apparent to me, having a vast knowledge of watches, is you designed this watch for an archetype, for a persona like you had your end consumer in mind how they were going to use the watch before you designed it, I could tell no, actually, yeah, I, I know people lately.
Jérôme Burgert:They talk a lot about their persona who is your like? Who's a Serica man, for example? But very, very honestly and very selfishly, the very first and only person I was trying and still is, still am trying to convince when I design watches myself. You know I have a rather broad watch culture myself. I used to. I used to be a watch journalist for for some time as well. So I've been, and that's how my I got educated as well.
Jérôme Burgert:You know I, from the early watch fairs in switzerland at the age 14 to the auction houses at age 23 or 40 or 30, I had the opportunity and the chance to put on the wrist so many of these watches. I've seen a lot, I put a lot on my wrist, I owned a few and that gave me the knowledge of it. That's what a proper watch should look and feel like, and to me, it's the only way to understand how it should feel. I mean, you can learn about watches online and you read and you see pictures, but the weight of the watch, how light interacts with different finishings, how curved lugs makes a watch feel on your wrist, and so on, it's something that needs to be experienced, and you said earlier I don't think that's something every watch designer thinks about or is aware about, but the reality, from my experience, is that not every designer who gets asked to design watches is a watch designer.
Jérôme Burgert:I mean, you said it looks good on paper but not on the wrist, and that's something that only a watch person can know and experience and know how important it is. I don't know if I had to compare with architecture, because it is some kind of architecture. We talk about the architecture of a movement, of a case, and it's something of beauty, we said earlier but it's something actually functional in the first place. So if you can't read time in a split second, if it doesn't feel comfortable on the wrist, then it's not good enough.
Blake Rea:You know what I mean?
Jérôme Burgert:yeah, and chasing greatness exactly and just like you know, when there is one architect that I love is ando talo, japanese architect. I don't know. You probably know the guy. No, maybe you can check it. Check it up later. Yeah, yeah, definitely. It's, uh like. He's been known for designing what appears from a distance very simple houses, concrete, blocks of concrete with wooden floors sometimes. And at the end of the day you say, yeah, sure, I mean, any five-year-old kid can draw a square, sure, but you cannot draw the perfect square until you know everything about the Roman architecture, the Renaissance, until you stepped into a church, see how the light go through, feel actually step into the space, because architecture is designing a space. And it's the same for watches. I mean, that might seem simple. Yeah, of course, you put a round instead of an arrow, a circle instead of an arrow for GMT hand, sure, but it's not that easy. It's like you cannot do that unless you've done all the work and the journey that leads you here?
Blake Rea:Are there any specific instances or maybe design cues, that, like you're proud I mean you're clearly proud of your products, right? We see that I am is.
Jérôme Burgert:Is there any like pieces that you could give us where you were?
Blake Rea:like you know, let's just say it was like 2 am. You were drawing something, you had a hunch. You went with us where you were. Like you know, let's just say it was like 2 am. You were drawing something, you had a hunch, you went with it and you're like, oh shit, like this this is the way yeah, this is perfect.
Blake Rea:You know like not to to toot your own horn, of course, but something something from an idea that you're, that that, like you're so proud of, that, now exists beyond the finished product. Sure, sure, sure. But it's.
Jérôme Burgert:And and we're going to talk about the gmt again, because it took me a long time to get to that gmt I'm not a trained designer, I'm a self-taught designer, sure, and my process I cannot talk about any other designers process, but my process into creating a watch is I I have a lot on my mind, I think about it a lot, and then, only when I know exactly when I want to go, I start drawing. And then I start drawing, I put something on paper, on the computer, and then I need to step away for a few days, sometimes a week, sometimes two weeks, and then open it again. And then I see differently and I was like, okay, this can be improved, this can be better. And until I step away from the design, come back to it and I'm just like a little kid with my eyes, like, okay, that's going to be great, that I want on my wrist, that I see harmony in this design From the first second. It strikes me as harmonious design and it answers every single question that needed to be answered. That's the only time like when I have that, then I will go. I will move forward into the production of a sample, for example. I will move forward into the production of a sample, for example.
Jérôme Burgert:And designing the GMT watch is something rather difficult because obviously Rolex did create something in 1954 with a very strong design language. We talked about it earlier again the Pepsi, orange and red, blah, blah, blah. So it was about finding the answer. But even I, like right now I'm bragging about yeah, you need to go find the origin of the question, but I did not at first and for the longest time, like I could see, like quickly, I had the idea of the two times 12 and the entire meridian plus meridian. So that appeared on my watch. I was like that's great, it's singular, it uh, it answers the question, it's easy to read, it's great.
Jérôme Burgert:But then the, the uneven split, was not there from the start. The uneven splits of the, of the bezel, you know the day night indicator. And for the longest time I tried to do something. I want to do something very refined and elegant. So I was like maybe we can just work on different finishing. Polish ceramic and circular brush ceramic could work. I tried that, but it was not, not, not easy to read, not easy enough to read, uh.
Jérôme Burgert:And then I couldn't get through the fact that when you split the sixes into two parts, then you need a third color, right, because you need something that contrasts with, for example, in our case, the black and the white. So you need to add something like Rolex that it was gray, I think, is it gray or white with the GMT Anyway and I did not want to add a third color. I just wanted the dash of earthy orange for the GMT hand, but I did not want to add any because I didn't want, I was afraid for the watch to look quirky and like too much information. Then you don't understand, like you miss the entire point, you don't see the whole song. So then I was okay, what about? We do not divide the sixes? What happens?
Jérôme Burgert:So you have the choice between making a longer day or a longer night, and we all busy men, we all live in 2024, where everything goes way too quickly. It was like, yeah, my day is much longer than my night. I look tired, I know I don't sleep enough, nights are short. So, okay, it's a positive thing to have a longer day segment, because when you see your day on 24 hours, like I have more time, that's daylight, that's activity time and anyway, the transition from day to night is not a switch at 6 am and 6 pm. It's very subjective, depending on where you live, where you reside in the world, what day of the year it is. So having an even split, if you think about it, it doesn't make much sense anyway to start with.
Jérôme Burgert:And then for the longest time the GMT hand was an arrow and it looked okay but it didn't look Sarah kind of, and for a month I was it's great but it's not it. It's good but it's not it. I need my own shape, but I did not want to add any quirky shape that comes out of nowhere, because I'm here to build on my own design language. I'm not here to find another solution out of the blue when I need one.
Jérôme Burgert:After many, many weeks and months about not seeing it, I looked at the 5303 and I saw the shape of the index linked to the minute track. You know those satellite hour indexes and if you just rotate this 180 degrees then you have a lollipop hand. So that big, broad lollipop design was already present in the 5303. And then I put it on my design and I was like I giggle, like a little child. I was like fuck, that was it. You know, as simple as it seems it was here. It was here all the time and I couldn't see it. So that's a tiny little design thing that I yeah, that I'm very happy about, for sure, because now it looks like a serica how?
Blake Rea:how do you see the future of the brand evolving?
Jérôme Burgert:um keep chasing the great, obviously but my my idea is to like our very our reason to be is to offer the serica proposition to all the types of watches that we love. Obviously, I fell in love with watches, with tool watches. That's what made me, oh, wow, like the, the instruments. You know, james bond, the james bond watch. I like it. I'm still a kid. That's what got it all started, you know. So, obviously, when we started the company, you always start with what you love most, and we started with the Field Watch and the Dive Watch, the GMT, and right now Serica obviously looks very much like a tool watch brand and that's what we do. That's who we are, that's for sure.
Jérôme Burgert:But in the future, obviously, I'd like to show people that Serica does not only know how to manufacture two watches. I mean, we make sports watches because even if tomorrow we set ourselves on designing a dress watch, a shaped watch, a super slim watch, I still would want this watch to be somehow waterproof, somehow life-proof in a way. But are many, many, yeah, there's so many directions, of course I want, I want to build women's watches like smaller, smaller watches. I want to have a chronograph, a serca chronograph. I'd love that. Dress, dress watches, I love that too. So there's still a long way to go. You know, like that, to me the future is already full of so many things that we can do and that still will be very Serica Before I run out of ideas into building Serica. That's a long way to go.
Blake Rea:Yeah, and something that I've noticed that maybe I haven't seen that you guys do, but a lot of other micro brands are very collaborative. Yeah.
Jérôme Burgert:Right.
Blake Rea:This is I mean. Forgive my ignorance, but I haven't seen anything like this from Serica yet.
Jérôme Burgert:We don't because it's well. I'm not saying that it's never going to happen, but if it happens it needs to be relevant, it needs to be something, it needs to make sense. That's it. You know, to me, like you've noticed, we're not into limited editions, we're not into collaborations, as you said, because too often it looks to me from the outside like very, very artificial ways to drive sales and to tell people this is not going to last long. There are just a few of them.
Jérôme Burgert:If you want one, you need to buy it quick, and that's not the way I want to sell Cerica watches. I know selling a watch to someone who will realize the next day like, oh, I shouldn't have because this watch is not. Wow, this watch is not offering anything special value-added. And finally the watch is in the drawer. It goes back to the market, to the secondhand. He wants to ditch it. I'm not interested in that.
Jérôme Burgert:I want people to come to us because they understand the quality of our watches. They understand what is it we do, how relevant it is, the quality of our watches. They understand what is it we do, how relevant it is, and just how joyful little mechanical objects can get into their lives and keep ticking for the longest time. And once you understand that, then don't rush, because a Cerica watch today will still be a Cerica watch tomorrow and the day after. So there is no rush there should be no rush into purchasing a mechanical watch anyway. It's not a t-shirt, it's not fast fashion, it's not instant gratification is choosing something very intimate that will remain with you for the longest time, saying that we all have more watches and wrists, obviously, but uh I don't know.
Blake Rea:I've never heard a watch brand say anything like that. Because they're taking. I guess they want to grow as quickly as they possibly can.
Jérôme Burgert:And rightfully so.
Blake Rea:Without sustainability, I want to last long, that's the thing I want to create something truly relevant again and and you see, um, you see them kind of like dipping their paint brush in novelty releases. You know where they just do novelty after novelty, after novelty after novelty. And what that does, I've noticed, at least in my opinion, is it takes the attention away from their core offering, of course, and yeah it, I would say. More often than not you have people purchasing watches for the wrong reasons like you said, you know all this is limited 250 pieces.
Blake Rea:I gotta buy it like. I'm not sure if I like it. It looks good on the internet. I'm not sure I'm just gonna buy it, you know um, and then, yeah, they get it, and for whatever reason, it just it doesn't get worn you know, not as appealing as in pictures and oh too bad, but it's uh, yeah, it's not.
Jérôme Burgert:I think when you I mean a novelty, of course it's a way to to attract attention when you don't have a big picture. And I was like, yeah, talk about me, talk about me, I'm you, I'm you, it's okay. I mean, I get it, but that's not what we're trying to create at Serica at all. It's the big picture, the longest possible run. And again, you know, as long as I work and design something and it's not shared with the world, it's mine, I can still correct it, I can still, change it, I can still. But once it's out there, there is nothing I can do. So if I put anything out there in a hurry, if I rush, and it's not exactly as good as I once envisioned, then of course I'm not going to be the only one who notices it. You will not that someone else will. And it was like, okay, serica, now they try to sell us watches, and of course I enjoy selling watches, because if I do not sell watches, the dream ends and I cannot keep on creating. And it's at the very economical game in which any entrepreneur and company owner has to face, but it doesn't give birth to the same watches or to the same anything really. If you create something, if your drive is I need to sell watches, I'll make a watch. It's not the same watch, as I want to create something special and I will put it in the life of someone and it will make him happy. It's not the same, not at all.
Jérôme Burgert:I got interviewed recently by a student. She was at business school and she was asking me questions about my approach, the market, the needs of blah, blah blah, and I was like the answer is the question is wrong, but I'm going to give you my answer still. Something, a service, a product, anything, really. Do not think market, do not think profit, do not think like, of course it's part of the thing, but you cannot start with that. Think about what will this object, how will it impact the life of someone? Because when you give life to an object, you make it for people, for someone that will adopt this idea, this object, in his daily life. How can it impact positively his life and why would he come to me to get it? And if you think like that, you don't make the same choices Because when it comes to okay, I can do that it's cheap and I make more money.
Jérôme Burgert:It was like whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. What about this way? Of course it's way more expensive, but it will be funded on the long run. What difference will it make to the final product in the life of the wearer? Oh, it will make like very, very simple, very simple example here those do you have any of those Serica's ball straps? Yes, on the GMT right. Yeah, yeah, I do, I have it on.
Blake Rea:Actually, I also have it on the field watch as well. Okay, I don't know why they sent it to me on that one. I was looking forward for the bracelet on that. One sent it to me on that one. I was looking forward for the bracelet on that one, but that's okay.
Jérôme Burgert:You don't have a bone clip. No, I don't. Oh shame.
Blake Rea:Shame, shame, shame. We'll take that, I know.
Jérôme Burgert:But see people say, okay, a serica just made a rubber strap. Yeah, sure, it's just a rubber strap, but 99% of the rubber straps out there are not of that quality.
Blake Rea:It's a weird strap, not not weird in a bad way, but it it is so thin and it's so comfortable and it's so resistant. Yeah, like I. I just feel like it's so rough you know what I mean, because usually like to to get that same effect. Like, like, like I. I have panerai, like I have a panerai watch, and I mean my rubber strap is like 10 millimeters alone.
Blake Rea:You know like uh, thick and and yeah, you know it's, but it also looks so unique. It looks like um I don't really know how to describe it like, because it's textured in the in the most unique way, like it looks.
Jérôme Burgert:It's trying really hard to look like leather.
Blake Rea:Okay, okay.
Jérôme Burgert:That's the idea, like the shape of the bracelet, the heavy tapering, the grain surface, like how thin it is. That's all stolen from leather Because we wanted something extremely good looking and elegant and refined. But again, we did not invent it because Tropic Star did it in the 70s.
Blake Rea:Sure sure.
Jérôme Burgert:But this quality nowadays is extremely hard to achieve because instead of compressed rubber they used injected rubber, and that's what we did. Again, it's way more expensive, of course. It's uh. It's very tough to find the, to have the right grain and everything, but it's the only way to be able to, to like to work on the strap that that is that thin and yet rugged and resistant. If you don't do that, it stretches and gets fragile. So that's why usually people okay, I want to sell a strap that doesn't come back, so I'm going to do a thick layer of rubber or FAM or silicone whatever, and I'm going to make sure it's stuff.
Blake Rea:No, no, no. And we try to think otherwise, I also hate when brands, when they're producing their rubber straps, they'll scent it with the vanilla. Yeah, yeah, yeah, when brands, when they're producing their rubber straps they'll scent it with the vanilla.
Blake Rea:Yes, yeah, it's like. And then, and then you go around the whole day and you're smelling like vanilla on your wrist, like like a baking show. It gives me the worst headache. Um, thank you for not doing that, by the way, it's like, not our thing, not our thing, not our thing. I think I already know the answer, but I'm going to ask it anyways what is your favorite watch release and why? And I think I'm just going to guess that it's the 8315, the travel chronometer.
Jérôme Burgert:I mean, obviously I love all of them, because if I do not love all of them they never get shown to you guys.
Blake Rea:They're your babies, right? I mean, how can you say you haven't helped your child?
Jérôme Burgert:Yeah, I couldn't tell you, my favorite song is definitely the latest. No, I could not tell. I cannot say that. But for the longest time, the California Dial, the Field Watch, has been my deal, perfect. Yeah, longest time, the the california dial, the field watch, has been my deal, perfect. Yeah, then the 53 has been my watch.
Jérôme Burgert:You know, I'm not, I'm not the kind of guy who changes watches every day or two or every week or every month. I, I like to spend time with my watches, I like to, to create memories with these watches, otherwise it's, I mean, it's not really my watch until I've been wearing it for a long time. That's how I feel. Um, then I, I wore, I wore the 5303 for the longest time as well, but for the past year, for the past year, year and a half since the first prototype of this one arrived, um, it's been very well, like the.
Jérôme Burgert:The camera is camera is reversed, it's a bit I don't know. Yeah, yeah, okay, here it is. It's a. Yeah, it's been very, very much my watch. But I, I tend to, I tend to wear garments in a like earthy, organic shades of Browns, uh, whites, uh, greens. So this really goes well with most of my outfits anyway, and it got this subtle different. I don't know it's. I like the H-15 a lot, plus, I get to play way too much with the 24-hour bezel. But my twin brother lives in Colombia, in-laws are in Vietnam. We work with the US a lot. My mates from university are in Japan, so you know I always want to know what time it is all around the world like calling them working. So to me it's very I don't know part of the GMT. Complication has always been something I've been fascinated with. It's long distance traveling, it's different cultures. It's, uh, different cultures. It's uh, yeah, you have, it's the world on your wrist, and how could that be not cool?
Blake Rea:yeah, yeah, yeah, um, yeah, I don't, I don't know um, like, personally, I'm very fortunate that I'm able to experience your entire collection. I'm very grateful that you guys, you know, sent me some some press watches. Um, I love his chair. Yeah, yeah, something that was like a turning point for me. I mean, obviously, I've had them for a few weeks now and hopefully I'll have them for another few more weeks because I'm taking.
Blake Rea:I'm taking a a trip next week and I wanted to take the entire Serica portfolio because I'm going to a watch club meetup. So, I was just going to say everybody wants to see your brand, everybody wants to see him. How could I say no to that? Yeah, yeah. So a lot of people are going to get to see them, and so last week I'm working on a video for glashuta original.
Blake Rea:Okay, yeah, great and and they sent me a cq for press right. So I've got like an eleven thousand dollar, twelve thousand dollar cq divers watch sitting there and I have it for like uh, like five days or something or, like you know, like four days, like a small period of time. But you guys have essentially sent me your, your entire portfolio. I'm like here, just send it back whenever and you would think, based upon the time I have with the cq versus the time I have with your watch, is you think logically that I would wear the cq right to experience it while I have a shorter period of time with it. But you know, here I, here I am, you know, with the 5303, like and I I just I haven't, I haven't taken it off and the best compliment ever man, it's something that I do.
Blake Rea:I change watches all the time. I literally change watches because I have every dream watch Not to toot my own horn, but I have every little boy's dream of watches, so I can grab any of them, you know, at any point, and uh, and I keep everything in my safe, right so, but there's, there's a watch that I will sleep next to right and and yeah, since this has came in, like it's very rare for me to wear a watch for three days in a row, like it's impossible, it never happens.
Jérôme Burgert:This is the best. This is the ultimate test. Way too often on forums or during conversations with watch guys, people always talk about the Grail watch, like you just did, and then, oh, that's my daily beater, and I tend to disagree the way that, okay, that's just my daily beater. No, I tend to disagree the way that, okay, that's just my daily beater. No, no, no, no, no. What's at the end of the day and the end of your life, because tomorrow we'll all get there Like what watch will be more important? The one you choose to wear every day or the one you wear once a year, like at New Year? You know, is it the watch that your friends and your family, and maybe your sons and daughters, have seen you wearing during your entire life Like the most? Or is it that great thing that stayed at the safe and, for me, the ultimate? That's what it is. I mean, I might not have every little child's dream watch in the safe, but, uh, but I have a few.
Jérôme Burgert:I have a few sure, sure, sure and I mean I do not feel that as they're at the safe and I do not feel the need to. I don't feel any better wearing an old sub or an old speedy or even something like. And I do wearing these because they tick all my boxes in a way. You know, and that's the ultimate test, because the daily beater, the so-called daily beater, is the one you pick in the morning and put on your wrist. It's the most intimate watch, it's the most important to me. So making that daily beater a real beautiful watch you know, it's just, it's a sentimental value is everything. But when the sentimental value applies to a real nice, beautiful thing, that is fireworks man, it's just, it's just too good, you know.
Blake Rea:It's a weird, it's a weird feeling to me and it's a weird thought process, because so I have so many watches that are so sentimental to me, like I, like I have a speed master that I love, but I, I don't, I don't wear it because it's so sentimental. I know that sounds so weird to say but that, that, like you know, obviously when I got married I was like I'm you know. I can only get married in one watch. Right Like so yeah, yeah.
Blake Rea:That was a speedy Um and and so yeah, like I like if, if anything were to happen to that watch, like I would just be devastated because it not only was it the watch that I got married in, but it was the first luxury watch purchase that I made. So you know, like, I had this one.
Blake Rea:Yeah, like the like, it was my first grail acquisition, right, um, and then I've just spiraled from there like into a crazy abyss. But, um, it's a challenging thing because I want to wear a lot of these watches that I have, but I don't want to lose that importance that comes with owning them you know, does that make?
Jérôme Burgert:any sense at all like I hear you, I mean I'm. My relation to watches is very different, obviously because I always bought.
Blake Rea:You should be, I hope so.
Jérôme Burgert:I mean, there are as many different reasons to like watches as people who like watches anyway, and it's a healthy thing From my point of view. I never so much enjoyed owning something I do not wear. As a collector, some people say I want every single Speedmaster on the planet and I get joy out of knowing that I have the entire collection. Why not? Good luck, good luck with that. Some of them are like yeah, I like to go to my museum sometimes as in the safe I open and that's nice. I clean them. I like to wear them.
Jérôme Burgert:I like to wear them. That's nice. I clean them, I like to wear them. I like to wear them. And if I don't, I feel that this beauty, this instrument, is kind of like wasted. No, it's like it could have a very adventurous life, and it's actually already in a nursery home. That's how I feel about the watch. Of course, I would not swim and dive and I would not travel to Brazil with a Patek. I'm not stupid either, sure, but if I, yeah, I don't know it needs to get some wrist time, otherwise it gets lonely.
Blake Rea:Yeah, I'm trying to figure that out because and that was kind of the concept like of the brand, like our brand name, right, like no matter how many watches you have, no matter how important they are, like your, your wrist like can't have enough, you know, if you're, if you're, if you're obsessed, like like we are um 360 days, two wrists, that's it yeah, I know I'm gonna start putting watch on my ankles and necks and stuff now.
Blake Rea:You know, like rihanna and stuff, um, but but no, like there there's. You know I'm not. I'm not just saying this because you're on the podcast, but I'm trying to to expressively say what I've thought about for over a week now. You know how to bring to words, you know, I knew you were coming on the podcast and you know we've been planning this for a while. Um, but how I could explain romantic and charming and familiar about your watches?
Jérôme Burgert:that I can't really place. The word you used is very interesting to me because when designing the watches and when explaining it to some of my friends back in 2019, you know, you notice how there is no sharp edges on my watches like I like the warmth of the design, the, the dome, crystal, the fonts, even even the fonts.
Jérôme Burgert:There is no sharp angle in any fonts and when trying to explain that back in 2019, I was telling my friends, like yeah, because a functional instrument is not good enough, I, I want romance, and you said the word romantic and the romance is to me that's what it is, because it's a very special emotion and feeling that you get out of wearing this watch. It's, it's not just a tool that tells time. It's, of course, it is a tool that tells time, but it also carries I don't know, a dream, an era, a story, something that is yet to be created and lived with the watch, but it's ready to take it on. You know, it's like give me, give me memories, I can take that. You know, in a way, I don't know if it makes sense.
Blake Rea:And I was explaining to my wife, you know, because obviously she knows I'm obsessed and I'm a sick person.
Jérôme Burgert:I'm sure she does.
Blake Rea:But you know, had I acquired a Serica sooner like, it probably would have saved me a lot of money.
Blake Rea:you know, a serica sooner like it probably would have saved me a lot of money, you know, because I I'm like, I'm peace, I'm like piecemealing these little designs that I like from this. You know, okay, I like the panerai, I like the, the, the arabic, you know the loom, like the sub-second boom. You know I like the crown guard and then, okay, I like the, the um. You know the uh the date. Just you know, I have a date just with the fluted bezel, jubilee and the cyclops and the. You know the uh the date. Just you know I have a date just with the fluted bezel, jubilee and the cyclops and the. You know the green romans, the, the wimbledon, and like um, and so I, I find I find little things that I appreciate about watches, but there's never, like, after I wear a watch, like I don't generally get full, you know what I mean, like I'm trying to bring that so it's like you like you get like, after a while it fades, like the emotion kind of fades.
Jérôme Burgert:Yeah, that's what you're trying to say, or?
Blake Rea:it's like um, it's like here in america, right, like once a year. Like you go to thanksgiving, right, and you stuff your face, you know and and you don't, and you don't, you don't move for like two days. You know you, just you.
Blake Rea:You plop down, you sleep in the same place that you, you fell into um, and so all the watches that I own are like snacks you know like I'll pick up a snack because I'm, you know I want to feast, you know I want to put, you know I want to eat a little something right I hear, but but, but something that's weird and I can't believe.
Blake Rea:I'm comparing your watch to a meal um but but, but no, like I I feel like full, you know um, when I'm wearing I mean specifically the 5303 um Because, like I said, I mean it's just I don't know it. Just it satisfies me in multiple different ways that I haven't been satisfied before, especially like the way the bracelet integrates to the case, like and just the comfort of the bracelet. I mean the bezel, I mean it's just so good. And yeah, I mean the case architecture, like how robust it feels while still being a compact package, arguably. And yeah, I just I don't know, I didn't know it's so. That's my rant.
Jérôme Burgert:No, I'm the worst like making comparisons most of the time. So I've, I must have said, way worse than comparing the watches to a meal myself, so don't worry about that one bit.
Jérôme Burgert:And again it's coming back to what we said earlier beauty it's like beauty. An object of beauty is a work of love. It starts from a vision, it starts from a will, and then it's like doing your homework and doing the work like till the very end, till you're very satisfied in each and every tiniest little detail that will compose the entire thing. And, and again it's like we're talking watches, obviously, but it works just as well for a meal. You want a beautiful meal or you want a crap one. You want a beautiful relationship or an ugly one. You know, it's the same thing. Really, it comes back to beauty, because those values, this love, that's what has been put into the design, into the watches, into the brand, into everything that we're trying to get out there. And I'm happy that people feel it and see it, because it's my job to think about all these tiny little details, it's my job to choose and to send the message out there. But there is absolutely no guarantee that it will be understood, you know, because it's so intangible. I mean, obviously the design choices are tangible, but what's behind the, the intention behind it? It's, it's in, it's into thin air, it's not, it's not printed on a page, you know it. It's just something that is felt. We talked about the romance earlier. The fact that people can feel that and the fact that it echoes louder and louder and that this nuance, these subtle little things because a serica watch is not a loud watch that it's recognized in a way, it makes me really, really happy. You know it's, and right now we've been doing not collaborations, but we I met so many amazing people since we started Serica, people that I would have never met otherwise, for sure. We we make watches for the, the US Secret Service in Paris. We did watches for École de Guerre. We're working on some special projects, but the fact that those guys from intelligence agencies and high-end government protection departments they see that when I design a watch again, we're going back to James Bond.
Jérôme Burgert:But that's who I wanted to be as a child and I was like, yeah, what would James Bond wear today? I mean, if you want to impersonate elegance within action, you don't think Jason Bourne, you think James Bond, right, yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's what I'm trying to convey with the watches as well. But the fact that these guys I did not knock at any door, I did not go there trying to sell them, my watches. They all came into the shop. I was like that's what we want, that's why we want. So it's kind of a full circle and it's uh, I mean it's great. I couldn't be happier about that what?
Blake Rea:what watch do they wear like? Which one sells the best in the intelligence community uh secret service is the the 5303 okay, uh, it called the gear with the intelligence community Secret Service is the 5303.
Jérôme Burgert:Okay, école de Guerre with the 6190, but that's also a matter of how can I say the École de Guerre. It brings together the Air Force, the Navy and the police force, kind of. So you cannot choose a chronograph or a dive watch. It needs to work with all of the cops. You know what I mean.
Blake Rea:Yeah, and going back to James Bond, do you think James Bond would wear the 5303? I think he should.
Jérôme Burgert:Okay, no, no, I think he totally would. I mean it's a tool watch, it's a proper instrument and it's very, very elegant. I mean the sub he used to wear, that's what it used to be, you know.
Blake Rea:Yeah, he's been wearing a lot of Seamasters recently too.
Jérôme Burgert:Yeah, but I'm not talking partnerships with brands who originated in the. It started with Pierce Brosnan and Omega, if I'm correct. But I'm talking before. I mean in the books. I know you've read the books, but in the books it's a Rolex, but it's not a Submariner. No, no, no, in the books it's a Datejust.
Blake Rea:Really, I thought it was a Submariner.
Jérôme Burgert:No, no, no. Then in the movies he's wearing a Submariner and then, Submariner. It remained because those guys they love the Submariner. I don't know if you heard the story about George Lazenby popping into the casting to become the next James Bond after Sean Connery and the guy he saw. He bought a Rolex because of James Bond and he showed up at the casting with his own personal watch. It was a Rolex. So that's the power of such a timeless character that still makes every little boy fantasize about his life.
Blake Rea:Yeah Well, we are encroaching nearly a short feature film here, so let's start to try and button things up. Uh, two questions that I will leave you with, sure? Um, obviously the future for serica is bright I'm a huge fan.
Jérôme Burgert:I'm a huge fan.
Blake Rea:We keep working for that sure you know how, if you could paint a perfect picture of the next decade of your brand. I'm sure you have milestones that you want to accomplish. If you would, you know, share some of those with us. That would be amazing.
Jérôme Burgert:What we would love to see, and it's not only me, it's also Gabriel and the people we work with. I mean, right now we have a brand that stands by itself with a narrow lineup of wonderful watches. Right now, we have only one boutique in Paris and we sell watches online, obviously worldwide, but not so many people, as you said, have the opportunity to feel the watches in a medal and pop them on the wrist, and I think it's a shame. So in the next decade, yeah, if I was to see Serica boutiques worldwide where people can actually get in, hear the story, spend a good moment, get to know firsthand and see and touch and feel the wonderful watches that are yet to be created, that would be a very bright future for us, for sure.
Jérôme Burgert:And it's not so much about I want to make more watches. No, it's true, I want to share the love with more and more people, because, of course, there are a lot of relevance in this offering, into what we're trying to create, but most future Serica owners do not know the brand just yet. But most future Serica owners do not know the brand just yet. So I think the next decade and the next, it's about keeping working equally hard in order to keep on producing like, staying true to our vision basically, and never to compromise with this, but then also to make the world know more about Serica watches, and that will go through making them actually be able to see the watches for real, for sure.
Blake Rea:Final question, and we touched on a lot. I mean, I think, as of now, we understand your design philosophy, we understand what powers you. You're fueled by creativity, perfection, and, yeah, so we touched on a lot. We've been having great success where, essentially, we turn our platform over to you, right, and so we touched on a lot. Is there anything you feel like we did not talk about that you want the listener, the audience, the customer to know that we did not talk about?
Jérôme Burgert:Interesting? Not really, because, as you said, we covered a lot and you've been a great host in the way that you pass the ball and that you let me speak. So maybe sometimes I did not answer exactly your question, but I did say what I wanted to share with the audience. Um, now we covered. You know, it's very important for me to share the very reason why we do things, because that's that's how you understand more. You know, like a watch, like anything else, is only understood by the knowledge you had of it. Like, of course, you have the first visual contact with it. I like it, I do not like it, but sometimes, like I don't really like it, but maybe I I'm missing something, maybe I don't understand it. And then when you know the reason why it was born this way or what fueled the creative process that gave birth to such a thing, then you start liking it. I don't know if you're into music as well.
Blake Rea:Do you like music, Music film, all that.
Jérôme Burgert:All that that great. You know, sometimes you hear something and it can be powerful, and then you learn about historical context, about biographical detail that makes you understand. And then you hear something else. And the example I usually take when I'm at the boutique with people it's you know, and it happened to me, you know, for the longest time, because my dad was, and still is, a really big jazz fan. I was fed with jazz music for my earliest days and it's a music I still listen to a lot these days, and so I used to listen to Billie Holiday, for example, and Lester Young.
Jérôme Burgert:And you can listen to my man and it's a great tune and you can hear suffering. You can hear it's like plaintive, it's very deep, it's very powerful, and then, like where did it come from? Is she just like a great interpreter? Like what did she go through? And then you learn about her life, and then you learn about the relationship she had with Lester Young, which is the very guy blowing the horn in the back when she sings my man. And then you hear something else entirely.
Jérôme Burgert:So I think back to the watches. I like seeing a Serica watch online as okay, it's pretty fine, and then you get to learn what's behind the passion that was fueled into a watch. You get to learn what's behind the passion that was fueled into a watch, the work that was necessary to achieve something as great in the metal that it once was in my little head. And when you know all that process, I think you see something differently. It's not just oh, it's quirky, oh, it's different, oh, I don't know, it was like it can turn that into oh, but it actually makes sense, and that's the reason why it's important to tell the story.
Blake Rea:I think Oops sorry, that's why we do it. I mean, that's exactly why we do it. When I sold watches, you know, like you can go into a vegas boutique because I live in las vegas and um, and you get a very atypical experience. Oh well, this watch has 300 meters of water resistance, it's a 40 millimeter case, uh, it's got super luminova and it's seven thousand dollars, you know, or whatever, right um and and beyond that, um it.
Blake Rea:It doesn't do the consumer any. It's like you know. It's just like a white, a white sheet, right like. You can go online and look at your favorite car and see, oh, it's got this size engine, it's got that, uh, but until you drive it like you don't know and you, you do get a lot of driving, you know, at these boutiques, right, getting hands-on, um, but you know a lot of the.
Blake Rea:The stories about cars get lost within the manufacturer, right, because the manufacturing processes are so vast there's there's so complex, right? Um, I mean, I can't interview, like the, the owner of audi, like the original owner, like the original out.
Jérôme Burgert:You know like longer nature, longer yeah yeah, you know.
Blake Rea:So you know, we, we want to encapsulate the future of the watch industry, while we can, you know, we want to, to, to bring you know, I mean ideally, if, if, if a future Mozart, you know, speaking of music, will be on our podcast, right, like we can, you know, cement this in in in culture, right and uh, and so, understanding why you do it, why you exist, why you're unique, how your approach is different, seeing your passion, seeing your creativity, getting to experience that with you through outlets like ours, is very important to us.
Jérôme Burgert:And to us Big time.
Blake Rea:Yeah, big time.
Jérôme Burgert:Yeah, big time. No no it's a I mean it's true, it's a true opportunity and a true chance, because I obviously not everybody get the chance to travel to Paris and meet up in the boutique and get a chat and have a coffee and see the watches, so giving us the opportunity to deliver our message and explain why it is that we are doing things. Thank you very much.
Blake Rea:You're very welcome. That is the best note we can end on right there. Thank you so much, my absolute pleasure, I wish. Gabriel could be here too, because it would be a fun little trio here. And you know again, thank you. Thank you so much for coming on.
Jérôme Burgert:He's covering the store right now.
Blake Rea:Yeah, yeah, that's okay. Um, you know, of course we will link Sarica and the podcast description. We have a ton of content that we're looping, sarica and on. Hopefully that'll be out by the time you guys are listening to this. And, uh, wear your watches and if you have a serica, wear that you can try it. Thank you very much everybody, thank you so much, bye.
